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Transportation: tickets vs daily passes 2014/4/8 23:20
Hi!

I'm going to visit Tokyo and Kyoto next month and still puzzled about transportation. At first I wanted to buy daily passes rather than buying tickets for each ride thinking that it would be cheaper and easier but when I've done the math I've discovered that it will be way cheaper by buying tickets. So... what do you think?

My itinerary is:

day 1: Tokyo arrival on Narita airport, hotel near Ueno station
day 2: Ueno area (Shitamachi Museum, Tosho-gu, Ueno Zoo, National Museum)
day 3: trip to Mt Fuji (Shibazakura festival)
day 4: Asakusa area (Senso-ji, Dempo-in, Sumida-koen, Tokyo Sky Tree)
day 5: traveling to Kyoto by shinkasen, hotel in Gojo-Karasuma
day 6: west area (Nijo-jo, Kinkaku-ji, Ryoan-ji, Ninna-ji)
day 7: central area (To-ji, Kodai-ji, Yasaka-jinja, Gion walk)
day 8: Osaka departure from KIX

Coming back to the transportation fares I consider the following to be the cheapest way to travel:

day 1: Keisei Skyliner (Narita-Ueno) 2000 YEN
day 2: no need for transportation since I can just walk
day 3: Tokyo Metro (Ueno-Shinjuku and return: 480 YEN) + Highway Bus (Shinjuku-Kawaguchiko and return: 1800 YEN) + bus to Shibazakura festival (not sure about the fees...) total of 2280 YEN
day 4: Tokyo Metro Ueno-Asakusa (170 YEN), Asakusa-Oshigae for Tokyo Sky Tree (240 YEN), Oshigae-Ueno (200 YEN) total of 610 YEN
day 5: Tokyo-Kyoto shinkasen Nozomi: 13500 YEN
day 6 and 7: 1 Kyoto Sightseeing Card useable 2 days (2000 YEN)
day 8: direct bus between Kyoto and KIX (2500 YEN) - I'm not sure if it really exists and how it's called since I just read about it in a travel guide, little help on this issue please...

In the end, the total for all transportation will be 22890 YEN.

I've used Hyperdia, Tokyo Metro and a Highway buses site for my calculations.

Considering all these above I don't believe to be useful a JR pass as I've often read or a day pass in Tokyo speaking in terms of the "cheapest way".

What do you think? Is it buying tickets so difficult that you would better spend more money on passes? I might not even be able to visit all I've planned so the transportation costs will be even smaller...

Anyway, thank you for reading such a long post, you are a hero if you resisted until the end. :)
by Annaise (guest)  

Re: Transportation: tickets vs daily passes 2014/4/9 12:27
A JR pass will not pay off for you; generally the rule of thumb for the 7-day pass is if you are taking a round-trip shinkansen ride in that time frame, it is worthwhile to get it. Since you're leaving from Osaka, it isn't worthwhile

Individual tickets are fine and quite easy to get, but can just be a bit of a hassle to buy every time you want to ride, and at peak times there can be a line for the machines. I'd recommend getting a suica when you get to Tokyo. It costs a few 100 yen to buy it (I think the price went up a little since I got mine 6 years ago, and also taxes were raised in April), but you can get that money back when you turn in the card. Then, just put 1000-2000 yen on it at a time as needed and you don't have to worry about getting tickets.
by scarreddragon rate this post as useful

Re: Transportation: tickets vs daily passes 2014/4/9 18:15
HI!

Thank you for your advice. I was wondering if it wouldn't be better to get a Pasmo card instead of Suica since I'll be traveling mostly using Tokyo Metro... Maybe I got it wrong, but wasn't Suica for JR trains and Pasmo for subway and railways other than JR?

And another thing, is there a direct bus between Kyoto and KIX as I've read?
by Annaise (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Transportation: Kyoto to KIX 2014/4/9 19:50

[From Karasuma Gojo in Kyoto City to KIX]

A railway route sounds to me better.

You can get from Karasuma Gojo to the main entrance of Kyoto Station on foot or by bus.
You can pass through nearby Central Gate and take a Ltd. Express Haruka (departing at Track 30 near the gate) to Kansai-airport Station (on the 2nd floor of KIX building).
In advance at a JR counter in NRT or in Tokyo, you can get issued a JR basic-fare ticket to travel from Ueno via Kyoto to Kansai-airport, a Shinkansen reserved seat ticket and a Ltd. Express reserved seat ticket. The regular JR cost will be 16710 yen.

If you use railroad only to Kyoto, the regular JR cost from Ueno will be 13600 yen.
The gap in the JR costs is 3110 yen.
A one-way fare for a ride from Kyoto to KIX on a direct limousine bus (departing near Hachijo gates of Kyoto Station and arriving to the 4th floor of KIX building) is 2550 yen.

So, if you pay 560 yen (= 3110 yen - 2550 yen) more, you can take a direct Ltd. Express Haruka.
A direct limousine bus runs directly to the floor for international flight departures, but in Kyoto you should get to a bus stop beyond Kyoto Station.

by omotenashi rate this post as useful

Re: Transportation: tickets vs daily passes 2014/4/9 22:11
Thank you a lot for all the info and detailed calculations, that was very helpful. Still, I'm not sure which one should I choose... Is the bus stop harder to find than the line for the Haruka Express? Is it safer (speaking about time management: less minutes of travel and lower probability to arrive late at the airport due to traffic issues) with the Haruka? My flight departures at 10:30am so since I'd like to be there at 8:00am I'll probably leave Kyoto at 6:30am.

I can't understand why you consider going by railway better and if you can please explain it one more time I'll really appreciate because as I see it, going with a bus is cheaper and for me every YEN matters... Still, I'd rather spend it if it's in my interest of course.
by Annaise (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Transportation: tickets vs daily passes 2014/4/10 07:35
In order to save money, you will recommend that you purchase a discount ticket at Narita or Tokyo, you are just like buying it in Kyoto.
http://www.tokyometro.jp/en/ticket/value/airport_bus/index.html

The IC card variety, such as Suica or Pasmo, it can be used to roughly in common, the company that you purchased, even if different. However, there must be a company that was purchased in order to request a refund.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2359_003.html

I recommend that you schedule two consecutive days for Tokyo sightseeing you if possible, is to Shibazakura festival, going to the fourth day, then you to go to Kyoto. That way, you will save time and cost.

Since you seem to be wondering about what goes by Bus or JR to Kansai Airport, I see by comparing the both.

Bus
Fee is 2,550 yen.
Terminal in Kyoto Hachijyo Higashi-guchi is located on the south side of Kyoto Station, to go there from the north, via the north-south passage, it takes 10 minutes or more. There is a need to be careful not to mistake the Hachijyo Nishi-guchi and there.
http://www.okkbus.co.jp/en/timetable/kix/f_kyt.html
When the bus is packed, so that ride it next. It is not possible to ride standing.

JR(Haruka)
Reserved seats (prices and freight) 3,370 yen. Not a reserved seat is 2,850 yen.
It is delayed 10 minutes or more, occasionally. This point is the same for means of the bus. Seat within it, even if it is crowded, you'll be that you ride standing instead. I think Haruka No.39 because it is the starting station is Kyoto Station, not be a full almost.
http://www.kansai-airport.or.jp/en/access/train/index.html

by passby168 rate this post as useful

Re: Transportation: tickets vs daily passes 2014/4/10 07:41
It is below the results of hyperdia If you got on the train.
http://www.hyperdia.com/en/cgi/en/search.html?dep_node=KYOTO&arv_node=...
by passby168 rate this post as useful

Re: Transportation: tickets vs daily passes 2014/4/10 17:07
Thank you for all the info, it was really helpful! I can't wait to arrive in Japan to put all that in practice!
by Annaise (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: transportation 2014/4/11 06:20
Is it safer (speaking about time management: less minutes of travel and lower probability to arrive late at the airport due to traffic issues) with the Haruka?
I suppose that generally the risk of being delayed much is lower concerning railroad than highway bus.
(The departure time of your plane was unknown, so I did not mention this risk in my previous post.)
Of course a trouble may happen also to railroad, but I seldom hear news like passengers got locked in a Ltd. Express train of an airport access.
[Inside Kanto Region]
wasn't Suica for JR trains and Pasmo for subway and railways other than JR?
Suica Cards and PASMO Cards have been replaceable in and round Tokyo, since PASMO systems began to work in March 2007.
Keisei Skyliner (Narita-Ueno) 2000 YEN
The cost is 2465 yen if you travel with an IC Card (Suica or PASMO).
This route is not the cheapest one, but if Keisei-Ueno Station is located close to your hotel, it may be the easiest route.
Your first station will be nether Keisei Narita of Keisei or Narita of JR; they are stations outside the airport.
If you fly into NRT Terminal 1, the official name of your first station is "Narita Airport."
If you fly into NRT Terminal 2, the official name of your first station is "Airport Terminal 2."
Seats of Keisei Skyliner trains and of JR-East Narita Express trains require reservation.
If you donft mind not reserving your seat until reaching Keisei-Ueno,
you can take only non-liner train(s) on Keisei Main Line for 1025 yen with your IC card;
in this case, in your Keisei station in NRT you will pass through both entrance and intermediate gates.
If Ueno Station of JR is located much closer to your hotel than Keisei-Ueno Station,
it is worth considering taking first a Narita Express in a reseved seat to Tokyo and second a Local train to Ueno, all for 1500 yen with a NfEX Tokyo Direct Ticket; one possible demerit of this route is the transfer in Tokyo is rather long.
Asakusa-Oshigae for Tokyo Skytree (240 YEN), Oshigae-Ueno (200 YEN) total of 610 YEN
I do not recommend the route Asakusa (G-19) -- (G-12) Mitsukoshimae (Z-09) -- (Z-14) Oshiage / the route Oshiage (Z-14) -- (Z-09) Mitsukoshimae (G-12) -- (G-16) Ueno.
A shorter route exits for each of the two, and in Mitsukoshimae Station, Ginza and Hanzomon Lines are apart.
(Tokyo Metro Transfer Planner on the website returns routes on Tokyo Metro subway lines only, so there may exist a better route including another linefs section.)
In Asakusa, you can get out to the ground via Exit 1, which is good for Sensoji Temple.
After touring Asakusa area, you can get down to Asakusa Station (A-18) of Toei subway via Entrance A4 and take a direct train to (A-20) Oshiage(not Oshigae) on Asakusa Line for 170 yen.
- Map of Asakusa Stations of Toei and Tokyo Metro subway
http://www.tokyometro.jp/station/asakusa/yardmap/images/yardmap.gif
In Oshiage, Exit B3 is good if you approach Tokyo Skytree from the outside. There is an elevator connecting the concourse and the exit.
After touring around Tokyo Skytree, you can use Toei subway back to (A-18) Asakusa and Tokyo Metro subway from Asakusa (G-19) back to (G-16) Ueno, for 265 yen with your IC card if you make the transfer within 30 minutes.
[From Ueno to Fuji Shibazakura Festivalfs site]
Tokyo Metro (Ueno-Shinjuku and return: 480 YEN)
You can take a JR train from Ueno (departing at Track 2) to Shinjuku (arriving at Track 14) for 194 yen with your IC Card. In Shinjuku, Track 14 is near West Gate, which is good for the highway bus terminal.
Highway Bus (Shinjuku-Kawaguchiko and return: 1800 YEN) + bus to Shibazakura festival (not sure about the fees...)
During the days of Fuji Shibazakura Festival, direct highway buses are available to and from the site for 4400 yen (= 2200 yen per way). The admission fee will be 520 yen.
However, if you choose these direct buses and make this roundtrip in one day, your time to enjoy the festival may be less than 4 hours.
If you take shuttle buses between Kawaguchiko Station and the festivalfs site, the highway bus fares will be 3500 yen, and the sum of the shuttle bus fares and the admission fee will be 1900 yen.

by omotenashi rate this post as useful

Re: Transportation: tickets vs daily passes 2014/4/18 17:12
Thank you very much for all the detailed info, it cleared up a lot of problems.

I was also wondering if a Tokyo Metro One-day Open Ticket (Adult) + Keisei Skyliner One-way Ticket (Limited Express) could be an option and if the one-day open ticket is valid only on the day of purchase or I can use it whenever I want. For example I'd like to use it after 2 days from buying it, is it possible?

To reserve a seat in Haruka/ Highway bus/ Skyliner I have to do it with several days ahead or I can just do it when buying the ticket 30 min before the departure let's say?

Also, another question I have is regarding the IC cards: can I use only one card for 2 persons or do i need two of them to enter the stations?
by Annaise (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: transportation 2014/4/19 14:43
[IC card]

Even when plural persons travel together, one IC card is needed for every traveler.
Fare-collection systems check your sessions separately concerning each IC card user.
Gate machines in stations are designed to accept only one person.

See also explanations on "Basic Use" in this article.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2359_003.html

[Subway]

You can choose a 2-day Tokyo Subway Ticket (to be sold at 1200), which will soon become available, for your subway rides in Days 3 and 4.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2017.html
However, this subway pass does not seem to pay off in Tokyo trips in your current itinerary.

A Tokyo Metro Open Ticket can be valid on Tokyo Metro subway lines only.
A route including a Toei subway line sounds better for you to travel from Asakusa to Oshiage and from Oshiage to Ueno.

For the highway bus terminal, Exit 3 of Toei subway Shinjuku Station sounds good.
http://www.kotsu.metro.tokyo.jp/subway/stations/shinjuku/e27.html

[Subway fares for adult IC card users concerning your Tokyo trips]
295 yen: Ueno (G-16) -- (G-04) Aoyama-itchome + Aoyama-itchome (E-24) -- (E-27) Shinjuku.
295 yen: Shinjuku (E-27) -- (E-24) Aoyama-itchome + Aoyama-itchome (G-04) -- (G-16) Ueno.
165 yen: Ueno (G-16) -- (G-19) Asakusa.
170 yen: Asakusa (A-18) -- (A-20) Oshiage.
265 yen: Oshiage (A-20) -- (A-18) Asakusa + Asakusa (G-19) -- (G-16) Ueno.
1190 yen in Total.


by omotenashi rate this post as useful

P. S. 2014/4/19 14:45
by omotenashi rate this post as useful

Re: Transportation: tickets vs daily passes 2014/4/21 18:14
Thanks again for all the info, could you please also help me with the seat reservation details? Do I have to do it several days ahead or I can just do it when buying the ticket, 30 min before the departure?
by Annaise (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Transportation: tickets vs daily passes 2014/4/23 17:34
Hello! I'm bothering you again, sorry!

As I was reviewing my transportation plan in Kyoto, I discovered that I don't know from where I could buy the Kyoto City Bus One Day Card (500 yen) and if it's valid for all my trip objectives (Nijo-jo, Kinkaku-ji, Ryoan-ji, Ninna-ji, To-ji, Kodai-ji, Yasaka-shrine). I plan to use buses no 101, 59 and 207 to reach all that from my hotel situated in Gojo Karasuma.

Anybody can help me with this info please?
by Annaise (guest) rate this post as useful

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