Japanese language vs. Chinese language

now im not talking about anything other than language here.
this mite be the wrong thread, but any help will do.
im so confused anything will help me.

basically...

im only 19 years old, but will be going to university to study a degree in the uk. anyway, i am doing a business and management degree....with a language, but whatever language i choose i also study that countries culture, history etc.

there are two languages i am debating to go to university to do....

chinese

or japanese


....now then, originally i wanted to study japanese and have been very interested in japan and its culture (a bit more than chinese)..

anyway enough of boring u, cut a long story short here are some points that are confusing me.....

- when doing job searches for research(in mycountry) there are a lot more jobs requiring japanese than mandarin.

- japanese i have heard is easier to learn, bearing in mind im new to learning something like this and im a student.

- the courses for japanese offer better opportunities to work abroad during the course..

but bearing in mind these advantages i dont want to do japanese to find that in 10 years time mandarin is going to be the big thing with big pay packets next to them compared to japanese....also if more mandarin jobs start coming up at a later stage then how bummered will i be.

also im thinking of learning spanish too.....how good would it be to speak the three biggest languages in the world...mandarin spanish and english.

also, my girlfriend is chinese.....so she could help me develop my chinese, wear by japanese id learn with class mates, while abroad in japan, and basically not on an all time regular basis (my gf does speak english).

also......some other points....

-japan has low crime rates, its a friendly polite culture and id love to be in that type or atmosphere.....altho i dont know what chinas like.....lot of corruption and crime???

-altho, japan has threats from earthquakes, flooding and north korea lol im joking...china doesnt have these threats right???

anyways, any info regarding these points...ur advice, and extra information u think i mite need would be fantastic, i hope u can help me thankyoouu..

Its really difficult to say.

There's no doubt that China is growing at a rapid pace, but you can never know what is going to happen in the future.

As for which is easier, pretty much both will be hard, especially if you start from square one. You're girl friend may helpyou with Chinese, but again, will she be your girlfriend / wife in 10 years time.

In the business and political world it is difficult to predict the future. Remember China is a Communist country, and if you're doing business with China that is something to think about.

You can do Japanese or Chinese and find out in 10 years the next big thing is in Russia, and you don't know Russian, I wouldn't kick myself because I didn't predict that, and it is hard to predict. China is growing at a very very rapid rate at the moment, Japan is more stable in my opinion and recovering from a recession from the bubble burst.

Kidding I don't expect people to do two at once even though I am.

I've studied Japanese for about 2 years and Chinese for about 4 months.
In my honest opinion; I think Chinese is easier from a understanding standpoint. No verb conjugations etc. However, I find speaking tones to be harder than understanding how to put together a sentence.
Japanese was easier to speak for me and harder to understand grammar.

On another note I find that the languages complement each other. I think my Japanese has been improving faster since I added it to my study patterns. Don�ft confuse that with me saying that languages similar. It�fs hard to explain in that regard. But, I think it because I�fm exposed to more Kanji more often and it has help me get a better feel for how words are constructed which helps guessing skills I think.

Japanese is THE hardest language for a native English speaker to learn, and English is THE hardest language for a native Japanese speaker. This is based on the linguistic structures and nuances of both the languages.

As far as business - Chinese is the way to go hands down. Japan is no longer an emerging economy and therefore it will not necessarily be at the forefront of economic growth around the world. Additionally, as the world's resources become depleted (e.g. oil) those countries endowed with resources will become more important - and so will their languages. This takes Japan off of that possibility. Although Japan is a very strong economic power, its potential for growth is minimal. China on the other hand, will continue to grow, though it will eventually slow - but not to the rate of Japan for a long while. Therefore the better long term investment is Chinese. However, as someone pointed out above - once you learn the writing system for Chinese it will be easier to pick up that aspect of Japanese. Grammatically Chinese won't help you too much in learning Japanese though.

Well first off, chinese gets a really bad rep, but in reality it is easier than japanese (especially mandarin). It only has 4 tones you need to remember and believe it or not you get used to them after like 5 months tops. The grammar is extremely easy. The only hard part is remember the characters.

Japanese is made up of many complex forms that are sometimes easily confused by english speakers.

The japanese kanji have two readings an onyomi and a kunyomi and each of those readings can have several different sounds.

As for which to choose for business, it honestly depends on what business you are planning on doing. No one can tell you what things are going to occur in the next ten years, but here are some things that I do know that won't change for a while.

If you work extremely hard at learning their language, the japanese might accept you as one of them, but the chinese will almost never accept you no matter how good you become (especially the older more conversative ones you'll probably end up doing business with)-and I'm not being racist I am actually quoting a few chinese friends I had-some of them actually had quite high positions.

I would say, go for japanese. You will most likely need an official translator no matter what with chinese.

Nobody can predict what language will be important in ten years. Even if the Chinese growth continues forever (there is no reason to assume this, though), you might find it hard to live in China or to do business there. A trip to Japan might be very pleasant for you, but this doesn't mean that a Japanese company or company doing business in Japan will employ you. So I think you should study what is interesting for you and meets your skills. You must be very good in your field, otherwise you won't get a job there. It is often said that engineers would be high in demand and low in supply - but without practical experience and with mediocre academic records it is hard to get an engineering job. Too many young people go into fields that seem to guarantee good career prospects only to find out that employers aren't interested in them.

Some people claim that Japanese would be hard, but I don't think so. The grammar is much easier than European languages including my native language, pronounciation is easy, there are much less kanji than in Chinese and you can write any word with hiragana or katakana (two syllable alphabets which are easy to learn in my opinion).

Again, you might find Chinese easier to learn than Japanese. If you are capable of thinking in another language than your native one, any language might be easy to learn for you. If you think in your native language and try to translate into the foreign language thinking about grammar rules, any language will be hard to learn.

So my advice is answering the following questions:

1) What country would you like to travel to in the future if you have both enough time and money? Where do you feel better, in Japan or in a Chinese speaking country?

2) Have you ever practised a martial art, meditation, traditional art etc. of Asian origin? If so, was it easy to remember the technical terms of it? I practised Judo in my childhood and I found it easy to remember the names of the techniques and the system of these names.

3) Do you prefer to memorize a lot of things (then Chinese might be easy for you) or do you prefer to learn logical rules (then Japanese might be easy for you)? Are you good at recognizing the logic of something new? This would also be helpful for learning Japanese.

4) Are you good at singing? Then the pronounciation of Chinese might be easy to learn for you.

i think im heading towards for the language perspective, and once got a foot hold on chinese learn japanese as an extra language. im determined to work hard enough for this, if i find it difficult i can just stick to chinese....but, what about the other points i mentioned. living standards, cleanliness...in japan it seems this is a lot better, also being in china means a lot of travelling...for vast size of it, and my little to none knowledge of the country itself, id rather stay in a small compact every thing is easy japan. but even smaller points like the japanese diet i prefer....

all of this is there, but with japans all ur life hierachy in one business, no support from government for set up businesses, its slowed economy, and the rising power of its next door neighbour makes me wonder is it going to be that perfect place soon....

i mean, another thing. because im studying one or other doesnt necessarily mean working in the country...
for japanese there are a lot of jobs in london working for japanese business's...

f*** it, ill learn them both.... lol, no seriously aaaghhh.

i suppose i could do the whole japanese thing at uni, but learn chinese too....and if i get employed in chinajust dont tell them my degree was to do with japan, im sure that wouldnt work.

Remember China is still a Communist country and there is strict control over businesses. Yahoo and Google were required to turn over the name of a blogger who was then arrested by Chinese officials, then had to answer the US Congress on why they did so.

While not trying to be political about it, remember you are going to be working with a Communist government that controls business, and depending on what type of business you do work in you might have to deal with that restriction, compared to a open market/capitalist economy found in other countries.

So learn the language, culture, and how to work in a Communist controlled society vs. a capitalist society, I assume you would want to take a few courses in World Economics as well. China is growing but at a great cost, they built a high speed maglev line in Shanghai at a cost of billions, but virtually no one rides it but tourists. At the moment they are building up for the upcoming Olympics, and there's big building in most of their major cities.

Japan is more stable at the moment, you can't go wrong there, China of course is building and there are business opporunities, there, I just in my opinion, think the Chinese market is unstable and unpredictable, especially with its Government really in control of things.

language:
I think eng-native people speak chinese easier than jpn,
for chinese & eng are similar grammer structure and how speaking, and difficult poini is only "kanji"

in future china
Chinese people can and will do china-busienss by themselves & global their network
for they live in all over the world and can speak many languages

in future in jpn
j-stragedy i dont know,
but slogan is "beatuful jpn"
perhaps the target is "a small beautiful life with good efficient of energy consumption"
common j-people know that natural resorces are limited valuable things and jpn has no oil

dont forget about India as an emerging power as well. As economist says, India is more self-sustaining economy unlike China which is growing mostly because of foreign investments. So learn Indian-English and may be a touch of Indian languages/culture.

I can see China's bubble bursting (in couple of decades) which will throw them in recession.

I'd choose whatever language is more interesting to you. If you choose something you like, you'll probably become better at it and be happier doing it. Although China is a growing economic power, nobody can predict the future.

In 10-15 years, you will probably have enough experience to not have much difficulty finding a job, despite the language you choose.

you could try going with your interest, japanese, cuz afterall, it's your interest that pushes you forward to learn something and to excel at it. without interest, you are just like a dead fish in the water. haha. plus, chinese is actually MUCH HARDER than japanese, although japanese's grammar is very confusing at the same time. i myself learn both english and chinese at school, and just started learning japanese like about one year ago. (:

i heard that japan is quite a close market where they would rather hire a person with slightly lower qualifications than you, a gaijin. perhaps they are afraid that you would offend a client due to your not-so accomplished profiency in japanese language as it comprises of many forms. =.="

heard that china will be one of the super power countries in years to come but somehow i just dont see how they are gonna do so... their political state is still quite messy in my opinion... and japan doesnt look like it will be going any further anymore... no offense to anyone. (:

you could try going with your interest, japanese, cuz afterall, it's your interest that pushes you forward to learn something and to excel at it. without interest, you are just like a dead fish in the water. haha. plus, chinese is actually MUCH HARDER than japanese, although japanese's grammar is very confusing at the same time. i myself learn both english and chinese at school, and just started learning japanese like about one year ago. (:

i heard that japan is quite a close market where they would rather hire a person with slightly lower qualifications than you, a gaijin. perhaps they are afraid that you would offend a client due to your not-so accomplished profiency in japanese language as it comprises of many forms. =.="

heard that china will be one of the super power countries in years to come but somehow i just dont see how they are gonna do so... their political state is still quite messy in my opinion... and japan doesnt look like it will be going any further anymore... no offense to anyone. (:

i heard that japan is quite a close market where they would rather hire a person with slightly lower qualifications than you, a gaijin. perhaps they are afraid that you would offend a client due to your not-so accomplished profiency in japanese language as it comprises of many forms. =.="

Which translates into the gaijin being the one with lower qualifications!

Of course, qualifications, including language and cultural skills, will be the main factor for employers. Furthermore, hiring a foreigner causes a lot of troubles regarding visa, etc. It is natural in any country to hire locals over foreigners unless the foreigner has some special skills they are seeking, e.g. native English skills in case of language instructors.

It seems like a lot of people here want to only be employees and nothing more. If your only worry is about finding a job, then japanese is a better language. The japanese have companies all over the world and there isn't much competition because most japanese people are pretty poor with english (according to testing Japan had the worst english scores in all of Asia). So if you have english and japanese under your belt you will have a pretty good leg up.

With chinese, there is WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY too much competition. As you may know, china is the most populous country in the world and many of the chinese speak mandarin and cantonese, which gives them a leg up on you.

Chinese is a good langauge to know if you want to have chinese business partners or want to do business in China, not for employment. But even still, as I wrote before, no matter how good your chinese is, chances are you will never be accepted as one of them, but since china relies on foreign investments, they might partner up with you if they need you.

As for the japanese-gaijin bias that was referred to, well it's natural since many foreigners can not speak japanese. The japanese automatically assume that a foreigner can not speak their language and is not fit for the job. This of course can be an advantage and a drawback. If you are actually very proficient in the language and learned to imitate them well, you can catch the employers off guard and surprise them with your proficiency and qualifications. But if you are actually bad at japanese and meet their expectations their bias will be held and they will pay little attention to your other abilities. It's more of a psychological thing than a japanese thing. Like people say, a first impression is very hard to break, well in these case the japanese feel like they already have a mini-first impression of the foreigner.

But even still, as I wrote before, no matter how good your chinese is, chances are you will never be accepted as one of them, but since china relies on foreign investments, they might partner up with you if they need you.

hi, but i dont really agree with what you said above.... though i am not a chinese(as in china citizenship), we chinese in singapore dont ostracize foreigners or anything just because you cant speak mandarin at all or very well, instead, if you knew basic mandarin, we would just say something like: 'all the better!' we are not as warped as you think we are... just my 2-cents worth. hope it doesnt offend anybody.

Your question is interesting because I went through the same thing three years ago when trying to decide between Mandarin, Japanese and Korean. Fortunately, I took all threee at once. But in terms of determining a language for you, this really isn't going to be easy.

Both languages are hard no matter what grammar or character memorization standpoint you're looking from. This is why the State Department in the United States catagorizes both languages as being a catagory IV, which are the languages which take the most amount of study compared to Spanish, German and Hindi. (I'm not saying Romance Languages are bad, I'm just saying they are very trivial compared to Mandarin and Japanese)

For Chinese, People always say, oh China is communist and therefore you can't do business there...Hello, did we forget about Taiwan which is equally as modern as Japan and does the same amount of business? Taiwan opened the doors for foreigners and foreign business from the Chinese standpoint. Mainland China might not be opening as fast, but considering its grown so much in the last 10 years, there is possibility for business. My uncle who is white and knows no Cantonese or Mandarin runs a business in Shenzhen (right above Hong Kong) and he's very successful. Don't let people tell you because China is "not stable" that it wont become powerful. Japan at one time wasn't stable as well, and look what it turned into. Basically, what I'm saying is, people learn 1st world country languages - like myself - because they are comfortable with what they know. (Japanese culture is foreign, I understand, but it is considerably more westernized that China). If you want to learn Chinese, you have to get used to the different culture (vise-versa for Japanese).

I took Chinese in high school and started to pick up Japanese in college because they shared a similar character set. But besides that, the cultures of the two countries are very different.

It's up to you. Go with what you're more comfortable with. I'm harder on Japanese because I like it more, but Chinese is needed in the future.

Maybe you should look up Korean as well :). No Chinese Characters needed anymore.

hey, well its me agen, got an email about a response and im like....eh lol.

anyway, im at university now. i decided to do japanese in the end, i thort id enjoy it more, plus i really wanna go to japan....the course is international business, so wud allow me to work abroad elsewhere to if needed.

hopefully it will get me some where, im jst tryin my best......oh, im also learning french now aswell lol...ill save the mandarin for another time. and korean? ive never even thort about it.

In high school, I can take Chinese, German, or Spanish. I would prefer Chinese, but does that interfere if I'm learning Japanese on my own? Thanks!

Nope, I think there's no problem.