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Dual citizenship 2015/3/26 14:52
Hello, my wife is Japanese, she was born in Japan. She lives in the US and wants to apply for American citizenship. I was wondering if she'll lose her Japanese citizenship? Some people say that it's unlikely, as long as she travels to Japan using her Japanese passport. Please advise, Thank you
by Pete (guest)  

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/3/26 18:10
Once she has decided she will choose to have a US citizenship, she will lose a Japanese citizenship. Japanese Govt doesn't admit a dual citizenship.
by tokyo friend 48 rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/3/27 07:11
Thank you for the reply, I understand that part, but I've heard about people having both passports. Does the Japanese government enforce this policy and is there any statistic or proof saying that Japanese citizens born in Japan will lose their passports or can't get their citizenship back (if born in Japan)?
by Pete (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/3/27 08:08
She can still hold a dual citizenship after turning 22, there is no penalty on that.
As she requests to make a Japanese passport renewal, the application form asks her whether she has a dual citizenship or not.
If you ticks on "YES", she will be asked why she has a dual citizenship after turning 22.
If she ticks on "NO", I suppose it will be against the Japanese passport control law.
If she has two passports at the age 21, she can still hold a dual citizenship for ten years but I'm not sure after that.
by tokyo friend 48 rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/3/27 19:37
Does the Japanese government enforce this policy

Yes, they do enforce it.

You have to understand the difference between dual-citizens and people like your wife who will NOT be dual-citizens.

You can only be a dual-citizen with Japan if you obtain the other citizenship passively. If your wife becomes a naturalized US citizen then she WILL lose her Japanese citizenship automatically on the spot. The Japanese government will not be notified of this so she will still be able to use her passport illegally but only until she gets caught.

is there any statistic or proof saying that Japanese citizens born in Japan will lose their passports

Yes, it's in the nationality law. There's a translated version you can easily find online.

can't get their citizenship back (if born in Japan)?

She can get her citizenship back if she moves to Japan and applies for it (naturalization). Of course, there's no guarantee that she will be approved.
by . (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/3/27 23:43
I agree with . (guest).
she loses her Japanese nationality, if she gets US nationality.
Japanese government has the right to cancel her Japanese nationality at any time when the government knows the evidence that she gets US nationality.

if she want to get Japanese nationality back, she must abandon her US nationality.

many people misunderstand the Koseki system. each Japanese is responsible for updating individual records.
for an example, if she gets married in US, she must report the marriage to the city office in Japan. otherwise, her koseki remains as a single. the reporting is her duty. in that case, her koseki record does not show the truth. she can get married with someone in Japan.

she can get a Japanese passport, if she does not register the truth. it is, of course, illegal.
by ken (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/4 11:47
I have a follow up question. Does anyone know if it's possible that she can lose her pension from Japan when she becomes an American citizen (assuming than her Japanese citizenship will be revoked)? She worked in japan for 25 years and she is approaching retirement age. Thank you,

by Pete (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/4 12:25
Both Japanese citizens and/or non-Japanese citizens have pension eligibility while they meet pension criteria.
by tokyo friend 48 rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/5 02:09
Thank you tokyo friend 48, so it means that you can be a nonresident to receive that pension (if eligible) ? I know she started receiving some small amount this past year, but we don't want her to loose it after she becomes an American citizen. She's still a Japanese citizen.
by Pete (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/5 07:15
Yes, she is eligible to receive her pension from Japan whether she is a Japanese or non-Japanese citizen. But majority of countries only permit one pension benefit while she is eligible to receive overseas benefit. So she needs to decide whether she gets pension benefit from Japan or from the country where she currently lives.
by tokyo friend 48 rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/5 10:40
I just want to clarify, by "pension" I meant Japanese equivalent of US Social Security benefits. I think it's a small amount of money. She does not have a pension set up by her employer, she will receive benefits from the Japanese government (I guess).
by Pete (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/5 11:19
Yeah, it's equivalent.
I think she only has Japanese pension benefit while she lives in oversea.
by tokyo friend 48 rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/5 11:54
current pension benefit is about 770000 yen per year for full payment (40 years).
if she paid for 25 years as a self-employer ( she did not join the company's system), the benefit will be 770000 X (25/40) = about 480000 yen per year.

if she worked in US, she also has a right to get the benefits from US side. the benefit payment itself is independent between Japan and US.
by ken (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/5 13:10
Thank you all for the response. So it's a good news, I was afraid that she might loose her Japanese benefits if she becomes US citizen.
by Pete (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/5 13:15

Ken says: "if she paid for 25 years as a self-employer ( she did not join the company's system), the benefit will be 770000 X (25/40) = about 480000 yen per year.
if she worked in US, she also has a right to get the benefits from US side. the benefit payment itself is independent between Japan and US. "

Well, as far as I know she left her company in Japan 20 years ago, and took a lump sum. Then she moved to US, but I think she still can get her pension from the Japanese Government. She's getting right now like an early payment (about $200). She will be 61 in July.
by Pete (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/5 17:35
there are different kinds of pension systems in Japan.
I am not a professional lawyer, shakai-hoken-roumushi,ЉیJm. therefore, my understanding may be wrong.

if she is 61 and she left the company 20 years ago, she was about 40 years old when she left Japan(stopped payment). since pension payment start from 20 years old. she only paid for 20 years. ???

what kind of pension system did she join at that time ?
check the document she received. what organization issued it ?
what is the exact name of the benefit in Japanese ?
by ken (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/6 04:43
Ken, she paid for 25 years for Kokumin Nenkin and 20 years for Kousei Nenkin. She started receiveing Kiso-Nennkin last year when she turned 60.
by Pete (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/6 22:22
I think she asked Jグx,"early payment" of kokumin-nenkin benefit. "early payment" has two cases, full amount and partial amount.
in general, kokumin-nenkin benefit will be paid after 65 years old.
everybody can ask early payment after 60 years old. but I think the benefit is reduced considerably. and the disadvantage of early payment is that the amount reduced is kept forever (not increased). if not sick right now, most of people will not ask the early payment (wait until 65 years old) to get more money.

I think 780000 x (25/40)x(70%) is the amount, when she asked "full" early payment at age 60. the balancing point (age) between full early payment and normal payment is about 76 (age). if she is alive more than 76, she loses some money expected.
Japanese woman of age 60 will be alive until 88 by statistical analysis.

in any way, she will have more money when she becomes 65. kousei-nenkin benefit will be paid.

kokumin-nenkin and kousei-nenkin are calculated independently.
by ken (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Dual citizenship 2015/5/7 11:21
Thanks Ken, she called Japan today and they told her that even if she loses her Japanese citizenship she will be able to receive her retirement. It's a good news, and makes sense. Thanks everyone for help, it's a nice forum with nice people :)
by Pete (guest) rate this post as useful

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