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I have upset a student ..
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2009/9/29 21:56
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Help! I seem to have upset a student of mine ! I have noticed that when giving gifts to someone in Japan there is often a polite refusal of it at first and then upon second or third attempt the gift is accepted with gratitude. I asked a friend about this and she said that it is considered rude by some to accept a gift at the first offering, hence the polite refusal . This also happens when a guest comes to your house and you offer them a drink, often they will politely refuse at first only to accept later. Well, bearing in mind what I knew about the polite declining , today , when a student offered me a souvenir, I politely protested something thinking it seemed the right thing to do , but instead of insisting she looked upset and withdrew it. She hurried out of the class at the end . I am very worried I have upset her and broken a major Japanese taboo!! and wonder what I can do or say to repair this situation? It would also be nice to learn the correct etiquette for accepting gifts .
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by Sam (guest)
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Student's Age
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2009/9/30 11:10
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I'm not sure how young your student is but in my opinion, what you're referring to is spot-on. You "refuse" gifts at first and then ultimately accept with great appreciation.
When it comes to younger kids and teenagers though, they don't know better. I always just accept the gift with a simple, "awwww, you shouldn't have" or "you didn't have to".
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by Bean (guest)
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In truth your student over reacted, and you did nothing wrong, PERIOD. That student if she dare to mention what she done to her parents, she would be scolded and told to apologize to you for disrespecting the 'sensei', and it will be her parents duty to apologize to you. Japanese rules is very firm about that.
But you feel bad about it? Simply speak to that student, very softly, and say, "Ki no no ko to - go men na sa i".
If ONLY she was my daughter,... lawn need to be cut, flower beds need to be weeded,.... geeez I am dreaming again LOL.
Tomorrow will be a better day.
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by EichoKago
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You had it spot on, as the above posters say. As a general etiquette among grown-ups with a lot of customary gift-giving, yes, that's what happens.
I don't know how young your student is, and in what words/tone you've refused, but I think there is a difference between relationship where "proper manners and customary gestures" take over, and others where "thoughts and friendship" take over. Maybe the student really genuinely meant it (as a token of respect/friendship she/he feels for you), not just a "required" gift from a student to her teacher, then if that gets refused as if it was just a customary gesture, that could upset the student a bit... the teacher in such a situation might say "oh that was kind of you - do you really mean it for me? - you shouldn't have... but thank you!" and accept it.
Also I don't even know if you were talking in English or Japanese - if you were talking in English, then the student could have taken it as genuinely coming from your English-speaking self (meaning you REALLY did not want it), instead of coming from your consideration for Japanese customs.
You could explain why you refused - because you've heard it's the right custom to say no once in Japan - and say sorry if that upset her.
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by AK
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Happens often these days?
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2009/9/30 15:54
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Is it still common for people to refuse a gift on the first offering? I have never seen a Japanese person do this in all the time I've been here, although I have heard of it.
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by Sira (guest)
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She's got a crush on you!
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2009/9/30 18:56
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Sam,
What I'm more interested in is HOW you ''politely protested'' this souvenior. What wording and facial expressions did you choose?
Anyway, this is one of the cutest stories on the forum. It reminds you of Valentine's Day when girls think for days and nights about what and how she should give chocolates to a certain boy, and then actually come up to that boy only to be refused just because the boy didn't want himself to be seen by his buddies, and then the girl runs away in embarrassment.
Sorry for the lengthly fantasy. Just go up to her when you can, tell her that it was a misunderstanding and say you want that souvenior if she still has it. But be sure to do it when no one is around. She doesn't want to be embarrassed again.
Btw, when practicing a custom that is new to me, I wait until someone shows me an example first, and then I just copy it. That way, I won't be doing it the wrong way.
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by Uco (guest)
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The custom is nothing unusual
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2009/9/30 19:01
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Sira,
Most of the time, I "refuse" gifts by saying in Japanese something along the lines of, "Oh! No, no, I can't accept that! You're wasting it on me!" and then when the sender insists, I say, "Are you sure?" and I take the gift. I see people doing it all the time in Hollywood movies, too.
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by Uco (guest)
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young and very shy!
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2009/9/30 21:54
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Well, thanks everyone who replied to my mail!
First, she is young, just turned 20, and she is also extremely polite, yet very shy! I get the impression she wanted to insist but was too shy or embarrassed to. We spoke in English so she could well have been unsure as to how to proceed.
She had also given me a souvenir the previous week but the other class member wasn't present . This time the other member was present and I wondered if she felt obligated to give me another one as I might feel "left out" ...
I will learn from the advice here and tread more carefully in future . Perhaps with younger people it is best just to accept it graciously with a smile...
I will try to find a good time to apologize to her.
Thanks for the Japanese sentence ! I will try it out .
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by sam (guest)
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feedback
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2009/10/23 17:52
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Hello everyone, I just wanted to let you know the outcome of the "I have upset a student" scenario. The week after the incident, I had a chance to speak to the student alone and I apologised for the previous week (having refused the gift). No sooner had I said the words "I'm very sorry about last week".. she chimed in "No No I am very sorry it was all my fault"! I explained at being unsure regarding Japanese etiquette and how I hadn't intended to be rude. We were both relieved after that and things were back to normal, she being her old self again. However, I have learnt an important lesson and have decided in future not to try doing things the Japanese way in certain situations for fear of upsetting/confusing someone. Perhaps some Japanese don't expect foreigners to adhere to Japanese codes of etiquette . And as foreigners tend to be more open and less subtle about things , if we say "no" then it may well be construed as "no!" by a Japanese person instead of the ambiguous no" which actually means "yes". Thanks everyone for your input!
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by sam (guest)
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Spot on!
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2009/10/25 10:14
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I think you made a really valid point when you said: "And as foreigners tend to be more open and less subtle about things , if we say "no" then it may well be construed as "no!" by a Japanese person instead of the ambiguous no" which actually means "yes"." Far better to graciously accept than to try and refuse and in the process unintentionally sound rude or ungrateful. In any case, as one earlier poster noted, refusing gifts hardly ever happens anymore...in my 10 years in Japan, I don't think I have ever seen it happen except in extremely formal situations...
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by Billyboy24
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Sam,
I am glad to hear that the situation has been resolved :) Thank you for coming back to give us an update.
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by AK
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just thought
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2009/10/27 01:06
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In my country Azerbaijan when you are given any present you have to accept it, or the person will get ofended if you do not take it. I undertand you that sometimes when we try to do sth good, it happens otherwise
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by azeri senem
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clarification
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2009/10/27 11:44
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Just to clarify, in Japan as well, when you are given any present you finally have to accept it. It's just that, before accepting the present, you suggest that you don't deserve it.
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by Uco (guest)
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remember u are not japanese
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2009/12/12 02:25
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Firstly, I wouldn't worry too much. Be extra kind to the student. If you feel really bad, you might pick up a small thank you card for her thoughtfulness. In the card, express that you thought she was too generous, and you couldn't accept, but that you wanted to thank her for her thinking about you.
In the future, keep in mind that no matter what the customs are in Japan, you are not Japanese. Most people will not expect you to conform to Japanese customs, especially more subtle customs. Because some people may know or assume that foreigners accept gifts graciously the first time, your lack of acceptance of her gift may be interpreted in terms of your perceived cultural norms, not hers. Especially if you did not first tell her how generous and kind she was, your decline might have felt less polite and more like a rejection.
Again, don't beat yourself up to much. You are a teacher, and this is a learning experience for both of you. I'm sure your student will be fine.
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by hiya (guest)
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"be Japanese"
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2009/12/12 08:37
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Thank you Hiya! What you wrote is true. It is a good lesson for me to have learned. During my time in Japan, I have caused myself unnecessary stress by trying to "be Japanese" so as not to offend others. But you are exactly right: I am not Japanese. While it is important to respect other people's cultures, trying to behave according to those codes of conduct is quite another thing altogether! There is a big difference between the two. Thanks.
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by Sam (guest)
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glad things worked out
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2009/12/16 02:30
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lol, my problem is, I'm an exchange student in Japan from America, although I'm a Taiwanese native, so this tend to confuse Japanese people as well as myself when I'm unsure of how to act.
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by fm47
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