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Kyoto - itinerary help 2016/5/16 23:32
Hello,

We are a group of 8, including 2 seniors and 4 young children.

This is our tentative itinerary for a long weekend in May. I would really appreciate some advice to firm up the details please.

THURS night arrive and stay at airport hotel.

FRI - go to Nara for half a day, then Kyoto. Check in at Gion accommodation. Visit Fushimu shrine.

SAT - Explore the Higashiyama area - Kiyomizu temple, Some of the Philosophers path, maybe some other temples. Gion district.

SUN - Arashiyama area in the morning. Nijojo in the afternoon

MON - go to Osaka (Namba) to eat street foods (Kuromon Ichiba market) and shop, fly out that night.

I am most concerned to work out transport arrangements first, so I can buy passes or book a vehicle.

1. I have read that the trains to Nara from KIX is not so easy and our luggage may be a problem. Would it be a good alternative to rent a car for the journey?

It looks like it is under 1.5hrs drive to Nara from KIX and then another 1hr to Kyoto, where we will return the car and use local transport.

2. If we do this, should we try to visit Arashiyama by car as well, given it is the furtherest attraction on our itinerary? Would there be parking available in the early afternoon on a Friday?

3. If the self drive is not a good idea, which would be the best pass to cover travel from KIX (via Nara) to Kyoto and back (via Osaka)?

4. Please suggest any changes that might work better - should we skip Nara to simplify the transport arrangements or to spend more time in Kyoto or Osaka? Any attractions we should add or skip?

5. I've heard traffic jams can be a problem in Kyoto. Are taxis or buses affected?


I will finetune the planning for these in the coming week, but appreciate any advice you have:

6. Suggestions of foods or places to eat, would be most welcome. Would I need to book ahead, since we are a large group?

7. I am just planning to see the bamboo grove in Arashiyama. I know there is a monkey park, but we're not so keen.

Would there be enough time afterwards to visit the Nijojo in the afternoon? I was thinking the nightingale floors would be interesting to see and the castle would be a good example of a different side of Japan to the temples.

Thanks very much in advance!
by Thankful (guest)  

Re: Kyoto - itinerary help 2016/5/17 18:51
Firstly, on Sunday and Monday
1. Nijo Castle shouldnt take the whole afternoon and I would rather visit Osaka or Himeji Castle.
2. I would spend Sunday night in Osaka, as the Namba area comes alive in the evening and onward. Namba is known for local food.

On vehicle. Do not get one. Driving in the city is a waste of time, especially finding overpriced parking. Only worthwhile if traveling long distances (you are not) or if you are going places with non-optimal public transport (again you are not). A pass like the Haruka & Icoca would work well for you.

For Qn 1. Answer is no. I would rather take the train to Kyoto, and visit Nara as a day trip from Kyoto. Saves the trouble of lugging luggage. Plus Nara has a direct train from Kyoto through charming countryside and sub-urban communities.

For Qn 2. No car! Arashiyama is an hour or less by train from nearly any other place in Kyoto! Where pay for parking and a car when it only costs about 200 yen per head!

For Qn 3. Haruka & Icoca makes sense but if you do not want the hassle of topping up monies into the Icoca card for 8 persons, getting a Kansai one day pass for KIX to Nara to Kyoto and then another such for Osaka to KIX. As for Kyoto to Osaka and all else, just pay the normal fare.

For Qn 4. IMO Kyoto beats Nara that beats Osaka. Osaka is better in the night than in the day, and Kyoto/Nara has not enough night activities to last more than two nights. Hope you are getting the hint here. As for Nara, it is a fun place to be if you like (raging) deer and large wooden temples. The architecture here is more subtle compared to Kyoto. I prefer Kyoto, but to each his own.

As long as it isn't the time for kids to go to school and adults to work and when they return home, transport is fine. Still I prefer taking the train though, more of a personal preference compared to the actual time taken to arrive. In short, the busy peak periods are the same with every other major city. Usually people on holiday would either be early risers and miss this period, or are taking things easy and would also miss this period. No matter, it won't be like the jams in the states.

Intercity travel is less crowded.

I have only once booked a place to eat (it was a pretty pricey place). I never had a group larger than 4. If you enter a restaurant before 6:30pm or after 8:30pm, sitting isnt a problem. As said above, tourists usually tend to start their day really early to do as much as possible or late to just relax; either way if you push your meal time accordingly (forward or backwards) you wouldn't be fighting the locals for seats. In the worse case scenario, go to a mid-range or high-end restaurant (e.g. those in Kyoto city station, other department stores, Gion, or Potoncho and surely Arashiyama).

For Qn 7. Not getting you. If you don't want to see them monkeys, then don't. I've been to Arashiyama at least thrice and have never seen them monkeys either. See enough in my everyday life already.

As mentioned Osaka and Himeji castles are more interesting castles. If you really want to do so though, Nijo castle shouldn't take more than two hours to stroll through. More than enough time.

Also note that Kyoto city is really small and the public transport is really good. I was once trapped in a jam going from one of the outlying attractions to the city central and it took about an hour + hour on a bus. I see no problem with not getting a car or traffic.

Lastly, on food. Ippudo and Ichiran Ramen would be good. For one near Gion where you would be at, there is tenkaippin ramen near Yasaka Shrine.

Kyoto is known for Kaiseki Ryori, Shojin Ryori, and Yudo Tofu. Ask Tourist information for where you can get the best and some not so expensive variants. The hotel above Kyoto station probably serves the best Kaiseki, Tenryuji does Shojin as other places in Arashiyama, and Yudo Tofu can be found from anywhere from Ryoan-ji temple to Shojin Dori to Arashiyama station.
Osaka is all about street food namely Okonomiyaki, Takoyaki, Omu Rice, beer, more Yakis.
by jh (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Kyoto - itinerary help 2016/5/18 00:59
Depending on how late you arrive on Thursday, you may as well just go to the hotel in Kansai. Even by relatively slow Haruka trains to Kyoto it's 1.5 hours only. I guess if you are getting in at 10 or 11 pm maybe, but if it's 7 or 8 maybe as well head to where you want to be. There are also bus options from KIX. I've not taken it in a few years but I use to take a direct bus between KIX and Namba and it only took around 45 minutes and cost a very reasonable amount. The airport buses and Haruka trains have luggage compartments. If you have a lot of luggage and don't want to worry about carrying it all over, there is a wonderful service called Takyuubin where you can forward your luggage, there is a desk at the airport. It's why you don't see Japanese people on shinkansen with tons of suitcases.

1) Parking in Japan can be a pain and very expensive. Also depending on your children's ages you will need to worry about car seats. Kyoto/Osaka/Nara are relatively built up and can have congestion issues. Nara is about 45 minutes from Tennoji or 45 minutes from Kyoto. Take an airport bus to either Kyoto or Namba and you will get to either location as fast or faster than if you were driving.

2) Depending on where yo are staying in Kyoto, Arashiyama is a really short trip. It's 15 minutes from Kyoto Station and trains vary from once ever 10 to 20 minutes depending on how you hit the station. Depending on where you are staying in Kyoto you can pick up the train in Nijo. I would not want to drive or park in Arashiyama. the streets are narrow with lots of people.

3) I admit I get confused by all the different passes and would have to read up. I tend to not jump back and forth so much between Kyoto/Nara/Osaka in a particular day and if I am, I have a JR pass because I started in Tokyo... I would not get a JR Pass based on your itinerary!

4) I like Kyoto, Nara and Osaka and all for different reasons. All have pluses and minuses a lot depends on what you and your travel group really like. Osaka is more of an actual city. It has an amazing aquarium, lots of shopping, lots of nightlife, and some good museums. Kyoto has more traditional goods and lots of temples and shrines but still feels like a city. Nara feels more "country." You either enjoy the deer in Nara or you don't. A lot of the sights are in one area, so you can walk there and walk to everything. I like walking. I also like making a side trip to Uji which I think is adorable.

5) I've been on buses in Kyoto caught in traffic it is frustrating. I try to use the subway and train system as much as possible and walk when I can. I've been on a few busy trains between Kyoto and Osaka, but I'll take a crowded train or subway over a crowded not moving bus any day. One thing to note, most public transport has seats reserved for elderly and people traveling with small children. Last time I was in Japan, I was pregnant, so I frequently asked people sitting in those reserved areas to move if they were not entitled to them. (aka elderly, pregnant, disabled, or had a small child.) Everyone gladly gave up their seat when asked.

6) I'm a picky eater so I'm not good at recommending places, sorry!

7) Unless you go into the monkey park you are unlikely to see monkeys. I have seen monkeys in the park, but they usually don't come down outside the park, especially since people can feed them in the park. I do have a friend who was living in Kyoto closer to Shugakuin Imperial Villa in Northern Kyoto and said that occasional monkeys would come down and steal fruit and vegetables from people's gardens.

Hope this helps!
by rkold rate this post as useful

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