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Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/19 01:31
Hi,

I have been searching many times but could not find similar routes from other travellers.

Here is my plan,

1. Travel from Shinjuku by bus to Lake Kawaguchi. Stay overnight there or is it enough time for me to travel to Odawara/Hakone?

2. Day trip to Hakone and Odawara. Overnight here

3. Depart to Nagoya by train, plan to join Toyota Kaikan tour at 10.30 am. Do I have enough time? If not, I will go sightseeing and overnight at Nagoya, join tour the next morning.

4. Depart to Shirakawago via bus. Enough time to go to Takayama on the same day for overnight?

5. Sight seeing at Takayama and return back to Tokyo. What is the best route? Or should I take return bus back to Nagoya?

Hope someone can help me sort this! I will be travelling with 2 small kids. Thanks

by faza2018  

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/19 10:41
For you Kawaguchiko and Hakone nights. You'll probably want to add another night.

A single night works, but only if you allow yourself a full day the next day, which you are not due to attempting to be in Nagoya by 0930-1000.

Takayama to Tokyo - Either via Toyama or Nagoya. Both are the same travel time wise normally. So pick whichever is cheaper option for yourself.
by hakata14 (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/19 10:59
Dear Hakata14,

Thank you so much for your thought. Due to time constraint, I will not try to spend more night at Hakone / Lake Kawaguchi. Perhaps, I will continue to stay at Nagoya but only visit Toyota Kaikan the next day.

For this, how about bus from Nagoya to Shirakawago? Do they only depart in the morning like in here? http://www.mwt.co.jp/shoryudo/timetable.pdf

Or this http://www.gifubus.co.jp/noriai/index.html?
by faza2018 rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/19 13:47
Toyota Kaikan is near Nagoya, but WAY out in the suburbs. It's at least an hour and 2-3 line transfers to get there from Nagoya Station. Especially with kids, I think it is a bit ambitious to try and make it all the way from Hakone by 10:30a.


The bus routes to Shirakawa-go usually go through Takayama. So I would probably go to Takayama first and do Shirakawa-go as a side trip. You can also take the Hida express train from Nagoya to Takayama if you prefer train to buses.
by Me2 (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/19 17:37
Dear me2.

Thanks for the heeds up. I will try to adjust where to stay the night before going to toyota. I need to wait until the open reservation for march, since we are planning to join tour plant.
by faza2018 rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/19 21:28
Habe you considered staying at Nagoya instead of Odawara? The last train from Odawara to Nagoya leaves shortly before 22:00 and brings you to Nagoya shortly before midnight. With one change.
I personally would prefer arriving late in the evening after resting and having dinner (bento) in the train rather than needing to get up really early in the morning.
If you go for the last train option I personally would get reserved seats, as the last train is quite popular with Japanese business men/women between Tokyo and Osaka spending the eve drinking with colleagues and then catching the last train back home.
by LikeBike rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/19 23:57
Hi LikeBike,

Thank you. I am considering departing to Nagoya on evening train provided that I can see much of Hakone. The ropeway, Owakudani, Open air museum, lake ashi. Maybe I should forget some places so I can go to Nagoya on time.

by faza2018 rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/20 00:02
Hi LikeBike

I never thought of doing seat reservation on night train. First time I received such advise. Definately good tips from you!
by faza2018 rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/20 02:53
Personally, I would not want to do a late night train with two small kids. For me that is a recipe for super cranky kids the next day. I've taken my elementary school child to Japan 2x and I always have to watch train times or I have an exhausted child the next day and a difficult time getting my kid off the train to the hotel. There were a few times last trip where my daughter fell asleep on the train and just did not want to get back up again.

You also haven't mentioned the ages of your children or whether you plan to buy them tickets and whether you are two or more adults traveling with kids or a single parent traveling with kids. I travel to Japan alone with my daughter as my spouse doesn't have the vacation time to come. If you do not buy your children seats or a pass, they will not be entitled to a seat and on a crowded train there is going to be someone next to you.

I honestly think the first two days sound good, I know my daughter when we first arrive in Japan is a morning person and even at home she is often up by 8:00 am. So with two young kids, getting out early might be easier for you than for an adult without kids.

If your kids are morning people if you catch a 7:04 or 7:08 shinkansen from Odawara to Toyohashi you can transfer to some local lines and be at the stations closest to Toyota Kaikan by 10:00 or 9:00 if you take the 7:04. I know for us, my daughter would have a much easier time taking the 7:00 train than a 22:00 train. If you can finish everything in Hakone by 18:30 you can just take a 18:36 train from Odawara to Toyohashi and overnight there. You'd arrive at 20:08 which is a lot more reasonable with two young kids. The open air museum closes at 17:00. According to Japan-Guide Owakudani station is open, but you can't actually walk around outside still and the air is not safe for those with respiratory issues.

If you wanted to make it all work, take a bus around 8:45-9 to Gotemba and then transfer to Sengoku and then catch a bus to the Open Air Museum. Eat lunch there and enjoy until like 2ish. Then take the funicular to the ropeway to the boat to Moto Hakone. You should be able to get to Moto Hakone by 4ish. Then you can either take the bus back from Moto Hakone to Hakone Yumoto or if you want to ride the Tozan line,take the bus to Kowakidani station. If you're careful about time you should be able to catch the 18:36. From Toyohashi you would just need to catch a train at 8:48 and would then be able to get to Mikawa-Toyota by 9:56 with plenty of time for your 10:30 tour.

I would be leery of going Takayama to Toyama unless you check trains very carefully. I missed the 11:00 (the first train of the day and the next wasn't until close to 1:30!) There are more trains to Nagoya. For me it would depend on whether the bus to Nagoya was faster or the train. I don't like taking longer trips than necessarily with a young child.

by rkold rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/20 10:45
Hi rkold.

Thank you so much for your input. Me and my spouse will be travelling with our 4years old and 2years old daughters. My plan is to bring an umbrella stroller for the 4years and my 2 years will use baby carrier, we have been using it since she was small and she is pretty comfortable in it even until now.

Whether to get up early in the morning, I think my spouse will have problem on that. Probably if we manage to overnight at Nagoya, I will spend 2 night there so we can rest a bit there. For Toyota visit, only my spouse and my 4 years daughter will join since age limit is 3 years old.

I really want to visit Shirakawago, but try not to have long journey going there. That is one of the reason why I plan to stop at Nagoya and the Toyota tour is a bonus.
by faza2018 rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/20 11:30
Hi!

At 4 mine loved her stroller too and when she was 2 loved her carrier. :)

I would still recommend against traveling too late at night with a 2 year and a 4 year old. If you have an umbrella stroller, just imagine trying to carry: an overnight bag, a stroller, the kid in a carrier and the 4 year old. And this is assuming you only have just one small overnight bag. Unless you're takyuubinning large bags around I still think it makes more sense to stay the night before in Toyohashi. It's a considerably shorter trip to Toyota Kaikan and is a shorter trip from Odawara. If you're not doing the tour, you can leave with your toddler for Nagoya and meet them there. Other than to meet takyuubinned bags, I can't imagine why you would pick to travel another 30-45 minutes further when it takes you further from the activity you want to do the next day and will make your train trip at night harder. Also do remember, if you do not buy your children seats, they will not be entitled to them, so if your seats are 3 across, there could be someone sitting next to you. When I went from Odawara to Kyoto in June 2016, the reserved section was completely full and non-reserved was also full until Nagoya. I bought my daughter a rail pass, so she could have a seat on the shinkansen, but when she was 5 did not buy a ticket for local buses/subways/non-JR travel.

I also think some of the buses in Hakone will be difficult. I've not been to Fuji 5 Lakes, it's never really interested me, but a lot of the buses in Hakone do not have any place to put an umbrella stroller and it could be cramped and very uncomfortable as non-expressway buses in Japan tend to be narrow. This could also be a problem in Fuji 5 Lakes though.

I went to Shirakawa Go in the Winter and with a tour group from Takayama, and I would not have wanted to have a stroller. Things could have changed since I was there, as it was 2010, but it was pretty slushy everywhere. In the Summer, maybe the pathways are easier to transverse, but someone else will have to comment on that. I can't remember if all the streets were actually paved. I don't think many places in Japan are designed with strollers in mind.

I took my daughter this past Summer to Takayama and she really enjoyed Hida no Sato, but she was able to walk everywhere.
by rkold rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/20 11:44
If you look for something to do while your wife is looking at cars, you could look at much bigger gcarsh in the train museum in Nagoya. No age limit there.

by LikeBike rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/20 12:32
Hi rkold.

The trip will be in early spring, 2nd week of March 2018. Travelling with stroller has been a concern too as many recalled Japan is not a stroller friendly place. Last October we travel somewhere local in my home country for 4 days without stroller and have difficulty when my 1st daughter want to sleep. So we figured we need a stroller for this Japan trip as she still nap during day time. As for the train, usually we will get ticket for my 4 years for our own convenient in my home country, so will definetely do the same for train ride in Japan.

Yes we plan to send luggage from Shinjuku to Nagoya. So for Lake Kawaguchi and Hakone we will only bring our overnight bag.
by faza2018 rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/20 12:34
Hi LikeBike,

It is actually my husband. Depending on how the activity for the previous day are, I might stay at hotel to rest or go to other museum as you suggest. Going to have like 3 hours ??? free time while waiting for tour to finish.
by faza2018 rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/20 12:59
Hi

Bus from Takayama or Kanazawa or Toyama go to Shirakwago. From Takayama to Shirakawago is only about 50mins while the other 2 routes take about 1.5hr & 1hr10mins respectively.

Takayama back to Tokyo
you could go via Toyama or via Nagoya, via Toyama travel time is shorter than via Nagoya but train frequency is much less frequent than Nagoya.

There are also bus from Takayama to Matsumoto, then bus from Matsumoto to Shinjuku depend if bus time table suitable.

Hope this help :)
by coco (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/20 13:07
Hi!

It takes a little more than 1 hour from Nagoya train station to Mikawa Toyota the closest stop to the plant. It is then an additional 20 minutes walking. So you're looking at close to three hours just in transport between Nagoya and the factory not including the time the tour takes. Your transit times could be longer depending on where you are staying in Nagoya or could possibly be shorter. If he's taking a cab the latest he can leave Nagoya station is 9, so he arrives at Mikawa Toyota at 10:04 (I put in arrive by 10:15 in Hyperdia because he needs to be at the reception by 10:30.

I was in Takayama/Shirakawa Go in February 22/23/24 of 2010. I don't know if that year was particularly snowy, but there was a lot of snow. Some of the roads were well cleared and some of the paths going to the houses were packed down snow. I have a very sturdy umbrella stroller and I deal with snow all the time, so I probably could have pushed through it, but I can't speak for your stroller/you. It's possible 3 weeks later there would be less snow, but it's all possible it would still be an issue.

I know about the nap thing. It use to be hard to travel because we always needed a dark room to nap in. I am glad mine is past that stage, but I do always need to be aware of will the long trip we take actually interest her and what time do I NEED to get her in bed. I try to take advantage of the mornings when she is alert.

If she needs a nap, depending on length, you might just have to pare down your trip. I am just not sure how easy it will be to find a time or place where you can let her nap if you're traveling around Hakone constantly or Fuji Five Lakes. Neither seems conducive to a decent nap to me, particularly Hakone where I've been. I think mine napped on the Hida train between Nagoya and Takayama. The seats are quite wide, though the train toilet was a squat one and that was a bit of a challenge.

I find it can still be hard to balance what we want to do and what my daughter can physically handle. It's very different than when I went to Japan alone.


by rkold rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/21 19:50
Hello.

Thank you so much for your sharing! It gives us a lot of things to consider as this will be our first time travelling outside our home country and for such a long period! Going to continue Tokyo for 5 days after Shirakawago.

I am still finalizing my first leg of visit outside Tokyo. We will continue with our initial plan and try to adjust the Toyota visit. Hopefully we get the date we want.

Thank you!
by faza2018 rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/22 07:15
The local buses within Kawaguchiko and Hakone are pretty small. So taking a umbrella stoller on them is messy. You will have to fold it up everywhere you go.

I found myself sitting a lot in Kawaguichiko and Hakone areas. Yes there is a lot of walking also. But generally I was on my bottom moreso.

Bus or train to locations = sitting, maybe a little walking within transfers.
Chureito Pagoda = walking stairs to top, walking back down access road. My 4yo, 6yo and 8yo had no issues.
Kachi Kachi Ropeway = sitting, a little walking a top.
Lake cruise = sitting, some walking around.
Hakone-Toazen railway = sitting.
Cable car = sitting.
Hakone Ropeway = sitting.
Owakudani = minimal walking to see sights/shops. maybe 10 minutes on foot.
Lake cruise = sitting, some walking around.
Hakone-Machi to Moto-Hakone = about 60-90 mins walking.
Hakone Shrine = 15 minutes walk from Moto-Hakone.

I'm not saying "dont take the stroller". Just decide if you really do need it. Lugging it around for 7-8 hours of the day cos you need it for one hours of the day isn't gonna make you happy.
by hakata14 (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Hakone to Nagoya to Shirakawago 2017/11/22 09:22
Hello,

The advise is really helpful! I do agree carry it as burden is more worst rather than carrying our daughter on the shoulder. We do have considered getting pocket stroller but do not want to spend so much just for this trip!

Maybe I will put a separate question on stroller and kids travelling to Japan to see more inputs!

Thank you so much.
by faza2018 rate this post as useful

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