Ruined friendship with JP friend

Hi everyone,

I would like to hear your advice, if you can help me on this issue. Thank you so much

I�fm a European man, in my early twenties. Recently I�fve been to Japan, for the first time. It was a great experience. I have been liking Japan for a long time so I was glad to discover the country. Well because I had been planning this trip for a long time, I started to learn Japanese last year, and thanks to this penpal website I could exchange in Japanese with Japanese people. More than improving my Japanese, I could enjoy a fantastic experience of discussing with native Japanese people. With some penpals whom I got along with, I could even talk by Skype, in Japanese. I was so happy to speak Japanese because in Europe you don�ft have the opportunity to speak Japanese.

I could even meet a few penpals in my home country, it was an interesting experience.
And when I announced that I was going to Japan, a few penpals proposed me to meet in person. It made me really glad and thankful. Those penpals are: both men and women, around my age or a bit older.

So I came to Japan, and I could meet a few penpals there. All of them were very friendly. They showed me around, and we talked in Japanese. Even if my Japanese is just a beginner level, I did my best to talk and they also spoke slowly to make it easier.

But here is the issue:
The last day I met a female penpal whom I�fd been communicating by mail and Skype since a few months. We were quite good friends because we used to send mails quite often, and do Skype sometimes. Although her age is close to mine, we were just friends, there was absolutely no romantic relationship involved. Just friends.
Together we went to sightseeing, all was great.
Unfortunately here is what happened: we went to eat lunch in a restaurant, and I�fm so shameful because I made a bad mistake. When we finished eating, she asked me to wait her outside, so I went outside but I completely forgot to pay my part in the bill. I was so ill-at-ease (it always happen when you first meet a penpal), I think I was just too destabilized. So, although I was about to pay, it went out of my head, and I went out without paying. She found me outside, and we continue to have a tour. We said goodbye one hour later. At that moment I really thought everything went ok because she NEVER told me about this, like �ghey you didn�ft pay in the restaurant�h. Although I assume she had to pay entire bill. Her behaviour after the restaurant was as usual, so I saw nothing.

The day after we said goodbye I came back to my home country. And I was quite surprised because she didn�ft send any mail for a long time, while penpals use to write a small mail after meeting. So recently I asked �ghow are you�h by mail, and she replied me and she told me about that event. You know I really couldn�ft imagine I�fve done this blunder, before she reminded me.
I was so shocked�c it was never my intention to go out without paying. What I did is so horrible. And the worst is: I can�ft help blaming myself because it doesn�ft looks like me at all, I�fve never done something like that before.
So I deeply apologized, and asked her to give her back the money as soon as possible. But she just replied that she forgives me, she understands it was not my purpose, however she was shocked by all this so she prefers to stop talking. She has been wondering for weeks why did I do that. Yeah, it hurts.
I insisted on giving her the money back but no reply since then.

I�fm so shameful about all this. It�fs all my fault. I ruined our friendship. And I would like to ask you what can I do, to fix it. I know it�fs almost impossible.. But we were good friends, I believe there is still a way to overpass sad events like this.
I wished she asked me �gyou didn�ft pay?�h immediately after going out of the restaurant, then I would have fixed everything. But it seems like it�fs not common for Japanese people to ask such questions so directly. I know that in my home country a friend would certainly ask this question directly. As a result this weird situation lasted for weeks.

Is there something I can do, now? Sorry that you cannot get the whole story, I cannot write all the details here.
I would like to give her back what I owe her. It�fs not about money, it�fs about fixing my mistake, for all the pain I cause to my friend.

Please, don�ft see a �ghidden purpose�h in my question. It�fs just about not losing a friend, I mean, not this way.
I have other Japanese friends. One could say �gthen forget this friend and focus on the others�h, but in my country a friend is very important, we just don�ft drop friends. I have always done everything I could for friends, I will continue.

Sorry for this very long post�c
You can tell me I�fm a fool, because yes I am. But, please let me know if you can advise me.
Thank you so much

Move on... It happens to me before too...

I can see where you are coming from as it happened in different ways to many other people in Japan.
I think that her reaction was kind of histerical in stopping contacting a good friend over such a silly matter, especially after you apologised so many time.

Japanese females likes to revenge in silent ways...and usually man covers all costs lol


if you have her address send her a very nice small present from your country with a very elegant polite not suggesting that real friendship would not stop for such a thing, and you wish to continue being in contact with her.
I would not send mails anymore as she made her point clear.

Good Luck

Sorry to hear of that mishap - my guess is that she must be upset about herself having been unable to communicate clearly to you what she expected. I mean, she said "please wait outside." Either she gets over that bad feeling of wondering why you did this and that... or she doesn't. I hope she will come to the same conclusion that losing a friend over one "whoops," however unusual that was, is foolish.

In the meantime, don't blame yourself, it just happened, and stay calm. Time will heal.

I have to agree with Claudia!

Yes, you did make a mistake - common sense should have told you!! I assume also in your country the man pays the bill - well, maybe I am a little old-fashioned (age related).

So, send her a nice small present from your country with a note, saying that you regret having made this "faux pas" (right spelling??) and that you would like to continue your "relationship". That should work!

In my experience with Japanese penpals they would never as we say "call you out" on such a blunder. In the states a buddy or friend would say " Hey , you wanted me to pay for you?" And maybe even have a laugh over it and you could buy the friend a beer or drink and move on. But J-penpals and people are about saving face, they don't want to embarass or shame anybody else. The best thing to do is write heart felt thank you and apology note about your blunder but make sure you detail start a fun time you had if you did. Also send enough money for your share and hers. But When you send her a note and the money, also send a unique gift or treats from your country or area. Each country has unique gifts and treats. With doing this you have done all you can do, there is no guarantee that she will still be your penpal or friend but you are being a gentleman and move on with class. And just learn from you unintentional mistake. Good luck. This is just advice from an old guy.

Geez, dude, reading your thread, one would think you have killed someone... The proper thing to do is to pay her back for what she paid for you, say sorry for the trouble, and that's that. If she's still not satisfied, she's not someone I would want as a friend.

I just want to tell you that in the 52 years of being a Japanese female, having had meals with friends both men and women, domestic and foreign, I've never met anyone, including myself, who would break a friendship just because the other person forgot to pay for one meal, no matter how cheap or expensive it was.

On the other hand, dozens of times I've seen friends in Japan forgeting to pay for meals. I think I've forgotten to pay a few times too. These things have never led to serious problems.

It's either that the OP is having a communication breakdown or the female friend is a weird person. Either way, the OP is wasting his time thinking about it.

Thank you so much for all your replies.

@Claudia: I forgot to mention that, I don't have her adress, as I've never been in her home and I have never sent her something by mail..!

@AK: I guess we would have fixed everything if this "whoops" was solved at the same moment it happened, but this weird situation lasted too long... that's my thoughts about it.

I wish I could send her some kind of present or apologize letter bue I cannot, lol

@Kulachan: good spelling :) You're right, usually men pay for women, especially if they are with their girlfriend or fiancee. But I'm afraid I cannot send anything to her, all I can do is using mail but, no reply...

@Travelman: that's what I thought too! because in my home country we use our sense of humor to solve weird situations like that :) One would have say "wow guy, you forgot to pay or what? haha"
I also assume that Japanese friends prefer to save face. All I can say is, I would have not been angry at all if she had asked me to pay her back. Because that's a normal thing in Europe. Too bad she took her precautions whereas there was no need to.

@Uco: no, she was not a weird person. And I have no communication breakdown lol
We used to talk like normal friends talk. Really nothing unusual about this.


Hum I may sound a bit too much worried about all this. Sorry if it gives you that feeling. Until I read your answers, I saw all this story from a bad angle. Thanks :)

I think that she wasn't into you as a friend, that's why she offered to you to wait her outside, so that she pays the whole bill and she doesn't feel like she owes you something.
The fact that you didn't offer to pay has most probably made her disappointed in you, but she couldn't say it directly to you, which is understandable.
I mean, what kind of person says "You forgot to pay?", "You should have paid?" and things like that? That would be really rude ^^;
The other person is supposed to know these things, without being reminded.
I think your apology once was enough and you shouldn't send her any money or presents. I think sending them will make the situation worse.
Just move on.

I thought it was a big problem lol Anyway, you apologized and that's enough. If someone really kept you as a friend they wouldn't break a friendship over something like this. Maybe both are at fault. She should of hint something instead of telling you to go wait outside. You should of remembered. Like some one mentioned, she was probably dissapointed that you didn't offer to pay. It happened to me too, but we joked about it. Oh well, move on.

I wrote that she asked me to "wait outside".
To be more precise, it's a little bit more tricky that that.
Actually, we had both finished our meals, we were ready to leave, she made me understand she was going to the bathroom so, because we were in this small restaurant and we had finished our meals, we agreed that I would wait for her outside, she didn't directly order me to leave. Anyway, it is the same.

I just add this precision because some of you may think that it was an invitation from her to pay for two.



I would be really glad to send her something more "friendly" than money, like a present from my home country. Unfortunately, I can't.....

question-guest,
If both of you finished your lunch, wasn't that the cue/time to pay?
What were you thinking to step outside without settling the bill?
If you were the gallant Aplha male, you should have paid for the lunch while she went to the ladies unless both of you had prior agreement to go Dutch - even then pay 1st.
Even with your male pals, the billis settled first before anyone leaves the place.

OP, to be honest, you're probably best off just letting this all go; put it down to experience and move on...

As others have noted, the situation you described can happen to anyone and in the normal course of things we don't cast off friends for making such a mistake. In your case, although you'd communicated online, this was the first time to meet this woman IRL so despite there being some common ground and understanding, perhaps from her own side, she didn't yet view you as real friends. What happened was a mistake and once realised, you have done all you can to show that you greatly regret it, yet she clearly sees your 'transgression' as a permanent black mark against your name and now wants nothing to do with you.

To me, this actually says far more about her than your forgetfulness at the time says about you. You talk about all the 'pain you caused her' but that's only because she CHOSE to play the hard done by victim and reject your attempts to make it better. If anything, it has been her unwillingness to communicate openly about it that has ended up making YOU the one suffering pain. I am sure she's not wasting her time asking people on internet forums how she could have handled it better and what can she do now...

You have done enough. She has formed a black and white image of you that allows for no shades of grey. That's her problem and I really feel that you should now just shrug your shoulders and admit that sometimes shit happens and then forget all about her and move on with your life.

Hope that lunch was a nice expensive one!

My question is�c at what point you realized you forgot to pay the bill first. It seem like to me you made a mistake. How can you forget the bill? I can understand if you�fre with a large group and everyone thought the other person is paying.

Second, how big was this place, why did she ask you to step outside? Was she embarrassed? What was she hiding?

Since there seem to be some missing stuff to this story I have to apply basic dating rules here. Sorry my friend, but I�fll have to say you mess up. Only reason why, basic dating 101, you take the girl out on a first date, you pay for the meal.

XYZ do make an interesting point, but I still don�ft get it why did she ask you to wait outside if she was not interested in you and wanted to pay for it all?

Do what business people would do, write it off as a lost.

When I was in Japan and the people I met who took me out, I always paid for everything, even when they offered to pay. I told them I want to pay to thank them for having me and taking me out. I know a few was shock or embarrassed as I explained it to them but when we went out the second time, it was half/half.

@Yet Another:
There might be another reason why I forgot to pay : in my home country, we receive the bill AFTER we have finished our meal. Usually we say "bill, please", someone brings the bill and then we pay.
But in Japan you receive the bill at the very beginning of the meal, and it stays on the table, near you. That may be a reason why I have not been "reminded" to pay at the end of the meal. As I wrote above, I was not even aware that I made this blunder, until she wrote me about this, by mail.


@OP: Yeah, I'm thinking about that too. I guess that if my penpal decides to cut off contact for a blunder, it wouldn't have lasted long. Sooner or later I would make a blunder, and she would then cut off. It happened this time, but it could have happened another time.
So I'm "moving on"

@Seiko: I wrote above how things happened in the restaurant. And yes it was very small, not a big place where you can stay for a long time, waiting your friend to come back.

About your "rules": I tried once to pay for both with a Japanese female friend (not her), my friend was so embarrased after I told her that I paid all, that the next time we met she insisted to pay all this time. And was still really embarrassed about this. Japanese people usually don't pay for 2 excepted if they are lovers. It is not the case for me.
And it's not "dating", she was a friend whom I met for the first time.

About your "rules": I tried once to pay for both with a Japanese female friend (not her), my friend was so embarrased after I told her that I paid all, that the next time we met she insisted to pay all this time. And was still really embarrassed about this.

You probably made her very uncomfortable with this, which made her feel ashamed, hence her embarrassment.
Sorry, but, mentioning to her that you paid all, was very rude of you.

@xyz:

well, probably, but this person was not the penpal whom I deal with in this page.
I would just say that at the time I went to Japan, I already concluded that it was a bad idea to pay for 2 with a Japanese friend, Japanese people are not used to deal with these situations.

I would just say that at the time I went to Japan, I already concluded that it was a bad idea to pay for 2 with a Japanese friend, Japanese people are not used to deal with these situations.

A person with good manners would not say such a thing directly to other people.

You do not know the Japanese manner. moreover, you know you did a bad thing, according to your country's manner. Here, you are making excuses and trying to justify your bad actions.