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Meaning of phrase 2013/2/20 06:13
Meaning of んと流す

Can anyone please explain the meaning of 得させんとながす to me.
Full sentence: 多くの人のために、罪の赦し得させんとながすものなり。
http://s.vndb.org/sf/25/36025.jpg

Thanks you very much for the help!
by DarkAkira  

Re: Meaning of phrase 2013/2/20 16:53
Roughly,
得させんと is old-fashioned expression,
it's 得させようとして or 得させるために today.
(However 得させる is rare expression.)
It's often used in historical play and samurai's talking.

BTW, I think 罪の赦し(を)得させんと(して)ながす is more easy to read.
by ajapaneseboy rate this post as useful

Re: Meaning of phrase 2013/2/20 17:13
汝等、皆この杯より飲め。これは我が契約の血なり。
多くの人の為に、罪の赦しを得させんと流すものなり

It didn't make sense by itself so I had to go back to the original URL.

As explained above, 得させんと is an old fashioned way to say 得させようと.

So the whole thing says (in modern-day English):
Everyone, drink from this cup/glass. This is the blood of my oath.
(This blood is something) I bleed so as to let many people gain forgiveness for their sins.

赦し(or 許し) を 得る to obtain forgiveness, to be forgiven
許しを得させる to let (someone else) obtain forgiveness, be forgiven
許しを得させよう intend to let (someone else) obtain forgiveness, be forgiven
by AK (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Meaning of phrase 2013/2/20 17:49
Hi,

Isn't it a part of "Holy Communion?"

Matthew 26:26-28

Now as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and after blessing it broke it and gave it to the disciples, and said, “Take, eat; this is my body.” And he took a cup, and when he had given thanks he gave it to them, saying, “Drink of it, all of you, for this is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.

主イエスわたされたまふ夜、パンを取り、祝してこれをさき、弟子達に与へていひたまふ「取りて食せよ、これは汝らのために与ふるわが体なり。わが記念としてこれを行へ」、また夕餐の後、杯をも前のごとくしていひたまふ「汝らみなこの杯より飲め、これは契約の我が血なり。多くの人のために罪の赦しを得させんとて流す所のものなり。飲むごとに我が記念として行へ」

I'm not sure but I hope this will help.
bye!
by kazz1972 (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Meaning of phrase 2013/2/20 17:55
Thanks, but still I'm a bit of confused in ようと.The one I know means ''even if'' like this one - http://dev.jgram.org/pages/viewOne.php?tagE=(yo)uga,(yo)uto
But as ajapaneseboy told me here 得させんと means like 得させようとして. Does it shortens only in Old Japanese like this(得させようとして - 得させんと) or I can find it in modern Japanese ?
by DarkAkira rate this post as useful

Re: Meaning of phrase 2013/2/20 18:29
This "you to" (even if) is different from what you have in your sentence.

The one in your current sentence is "esaseyou + to." The "you" is part of the verb, or actually a helping verb meaning "intending to..."
by AK (guest) rate this post as useful

Re: Meaning of phrase 2013/2/20 18:39
得させようとして and 得させるために are alike.
In this case, "ようと" is here.
http://dev.jgram.org/pages/viewOne.php?tagE=youtosuru
http://dev.jgram.org/pages/viewOne.php?tagE=youtosuru,%20part%20II

http://dev.jgram.org/pages/viewOne.php?tagE=(yo)uga,(yo)uto
This is rather ようが and ようとも than ようと.
Both means "even if".
by ajapaneseboy rate this post as useful

Re: Meaning of phrase 2013/2/21 00:37
Thanks to everyone!
by DarkAkira rate this post as useful

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