Neighborhood association pressure

Hello everyone, hoping you can help me with a problem, I am PR resident and homeowner for the last 2 years in Chiba prefecture.

Recently I have had a problem with the new chief of the neighborhood association. He came around and requested we join the neighborhood association (chōnaikai). We refused, as we don't really take part in any community events and I can't really read the Japanese literature and communicate well with the older neighbors around me anyway. As far as I know anyway, it is voluntary join, but he was giving us some pressure. This was not an issue for the last 2 leaders of the association.

We started taking our turn cleaning the local garbage disposal area when we first moved in, but then stopped when our work schedules sometimes conflicted with the neighbors expectations of when the garbage net should be put out and taken in, and when it should be cleaned. If we have to work, we can't do it on time! Also, there was just a lot of complaining by the the older residents around us if things were not perfect.
However, us quitting the cleaning was also not an issue for the last leader.

But now, the new leader says if we don't clean it, we won't be allowed to put our garbage there! He even said he would stand there in the morning to make sure we didn't put our trash out.
The city says we can't make another area for dispoal.

My question is does he have the authority or legal power to block us from putting our garbage out?

I pay my taxes and think I have a right to use the common disposal area whether I can help with the cleaning or not. I will contact the city office about this, but if there are legal problems, I'd like to know beforehand. Seems a little like power harassment or bullying to me.

Any thoughts or advice would be a great help.
Thanks everyone in advance!

I think it is rather selfish not to join a neighborhood association. I assume you are not paying the contributions either, are you? I understand that some people in your neighborhood will be frustrated about you.

I recommend to join the neighborhood association, pay the fees and explain them nicely that your work schedules do not allow to do garbage duties. I am sure you will get their understanding. And if the current leader is simply a jerk, try to approach somebody nicer and ask them for advice.

Why do you think you can use a facility you don't participate in maintenance nor paying fees for that?
If you are willing to clean the area up by yourself regularly, which people in the neighborhood association do, tell the chief you are willing to do so. He may compromise about your membership.

Maybe there is a misunderstanding or some kind of cultural difference here.

In Japan, we believe that each person can get support from the society, but the person is expected to contribute to that society. That's how society is suppose to work here in Japan.

For example, we need to put out our garbage. Otherwise, our homes will be filthy, and then diseases may spread all through the neighborhood and eventually to the whole country. It would be great if public servants clean the garbage collection area spic-and-span, using our taxes. But public servants don't have time for that. Besides, if we neighbors can take turns cleaning it up, the public servants can focus on something that no one else can, such as to drive the collection trucks on time.

Now, back to the topic, every person has the right not to join the chounai-kai. But by joining it, you would have more opportunity to speak up.

For example, you might have something to complain about. But if you just complain, your neighbors would think, "Ugh, he's a foreign person not willing to learn our language or culture but just wants to complain." But if you join the community and do the work, more people would think, "Well, he's doing the job and he's trying hard to communicate. He may have language barrier and he may come from a different culture, but let us help him since he's such a good neighbor. Let's listen to what he needs to say." And neighbors would be able to spread the word to other neighbors who hadn't had the chance to agree.

I think this is what your new leader is trying to do. Maybe someone you know can interpret for you to clarify. Perhaps your city hall provides some kind of free interpreting service.

I hope this helps.

I assume that you are living in a detached house (not in an apartment building).

This is something that leads to neighborhood disputes also among local residents, particularly where the community is a tightly knit one.

It is true that signing up with community association (�gchonaikai�h) is voluntary and not mandatory. So they cannot "force" you to join.

However, - and this "however" is the difficult part - since the association is working together for the betterment of the community – including keeping the garbage disposal area clean, which needs to be done by someone – I find it �gdecent�h for all residents to contribute in some way too, either at least by paying the fee, participating in the cleaning up, or participating in other activities - some associations have park cleaning initiatives on some weekends, pitching in contributions to local festivals, etc.

And yes paying the fee, and explaining in a nice way that you cannot participate in the clean-up, will bring better neighbor relationship. Maybe the previous �gleaders�h didn�ft bring it up, but they might be finding it difficult to get people to do the cleanup, and someone might have finally said �gwell that family hasn�ft been helping recently,�h which could have let to the new one speaking up to you.

Thanks everyone, I agree with many of your responses and I agree that it is responsible and right to contribute and it's a give and take thing here.
As I said we did participate in the cleaning until schedules became difficult and neighbors started complaining and nagging us all the time over every little imperfection -- since we are the youngest household here maybe... there is a seniority belief among these older folks.

My issue is twofold... one .. If they want money for the members fee, (entrance fee 10,000 yen), they don't seem to explain clearly and show where the money goes. I don't make it a habit to give money to just anyone who asks for it. And anyway, I;m not really interested in it. I simply enjoy my privacy and want to live peacefully.

Second - and more importantly. I really took issue with how the chief strongly said - "if you don't take part in cleaning, you can't use this facility" I pay my taxes and figure I have a right to put my garbage out.
Does HE have a right to say I can't? Does he have legal authority to say that and stop me???

To me it seems a little like power tripping. Unless he has legal authority to do so.

Any thoughts?

Thanks guys

Hi again.

members fee, (entrance fee 10,000 yen), they don't seem to explain clearly and show where the money goes.

That is a huge problem, if you ask me. At least, the association is obligated to report final accounts. In my neighborhood, this is done through the "kairanban" (circulation bulletin). Perhaps the kairanban only goes through chonaikai members. In any case, you have the right to ask for it to your leader.

10,000 yen is also quite a huge amount for a chonaikai fee. Perhaps your chonaikai is collecting some extra money for savings in case of emergency. You can find that out through the accounts reports as well.

I think you do need to talk to your municipal (city hall or ward office or whatever the place is that you got your foreign registration done). You need to have a third person sort it out. You can have your second problem solved along with it. They may even have a division or non-profit group you are there to solve cultural gap problems between foreign residents.

By the way, I don't know about laws, but I can well understand if your neighbors don't welcome those putting out garbage when they can't obey the garbage rules. But keeping garbage inside your home is not a solution, and putting out garbage elsewhere is usually against the bylaw, so I suppose they are just saying that. Or to be precise, the old-timers may not know what else they can do about it.

First point: they should have some accounts where they pool the money, use them as needed for the community, and keep record of it. They often spend it on cleaning supplies, some (if they have that) for local festival, and (if they do this) for hot refreshments during winter when the residents go around the neighborhood in the evenings alerting everyone to be careful not to let any fire break out in the dry air.

As I said earlier, your second point does get to be an issue among local (Japanese) residents too. Since you pay taxes, yes, you have the right to use the city�fs garbage collection. But who is it that needs to maintain the area? The residents themselves, and how that is done is left up to the residents themselves. And the residents around you seem to have been working out things fine with their own rules. Are you doing anything to contribute to that? Currently, no. So, your contribution is needed. Possibly you could contribute by paying in a bit more (instead of doing the cleaning yourselves).

This is what living in Japan (except for very urban areas where no one knows who�fs next door) is all about, though. I don�ft know which part of Chiba you are talking about (and I am not asking), but I have seen different neighborhoods (lived in four different locations within Chiba prefecture, of which two within Chiba city, and have relatives in other cities within Chiba prefecture), and in some areas, communities might be seen more important than privacy. So I might suggest making peace with the neighborhood rather than disconnecting from them.


I might add that I am Japanese, living with my non-Japanese but Japanese-speaking/reading spouse owning a unit in an apartment building. All the unit owners form a group, and as a whole are a member of the �gchonaikai,�h and pay the fee. This is in addition to paying administrative fees to the janitor to clean up the garbage disposal area. Long-time home owners sometimes do not trust the newcomers (such as apartment unit owners who might come and go), so the group as a whole stay attentive to maintaining a good neighborhood relationship with those around our building.

Also, I make extra efforts to be helpful with the unit owner meetings and occasions so that other unit owners won�ft say �goh you know those foreigners (and their families) don�ft have sense of community do they�c�h This is my peace-keeping tactics.

To Uco-san,
I believe the amount must be for initial �gjoining�h (plus the first year), OR possibly they are trying to collect the fee for the past years when the OP didn�ft pay. For a single-year fee, yes I agree it is too high.

Thanks for the input everyone.
I will connect with city office Monday, but really guessing about the right to put out garbage.

He says he will stand out there tomorrow morning to make sure I don't put my garbage out.
Of course I do not want any physical or even verbal altercation, but if I have a residents right to put my trash out without interference, I want to exercise my right!.. it's only proper I feel.

Obligation and legality are different things. I agree that we are all obligated to take care of our area, but if uncontrollable things get in the way of that, and I cannot carry out the 'obligations'... Does he have the power to stop my rights in this situation?

If we can't use our designated area... what choice do I have, I have equal rights to everyone.

this should be one of the reasons landlords don't want to rent their properties to foreigners.

You said that your schedules have prevented you from doing your part in cleaning the communal area. Are your schedules so busy that you cannot spare any time at all during the week to clean an area that you use? Regardless of legality, it would be polite for you to contribute to the cleaning - you can't expect your neighbours to contribute and you benefit without doing your share. Surely you can find some time during the week to help out. This would be the right thing to do, and I can understand people getting annoyed - they feel that they are doing all the work while you reap the rewards with no contribution.

The last part – if you can�ft carry out the obligations due to uncontrollable things, then you could consider doing something else to make up for it, which you don�ft seem to be doing.
I hope you find a solution to this.

Thanks again,
The reason I couldn't do my part was they demand the net to be put out about 30 min (7:30AM) before the garbage truck comes (there is no permanent fixture or box for the trash, then they expect it to be taken away and given to the next person and the area cleaned soon after the truck leaves, say 8:30 - 9:00... that is commuting time for work and we can't be there.

Anyway, I know you all think I should do 'something', but no one has really been able to answer my real question.....

Does he have any authority legally to prevent me from putting out garbage in my designated area?

What I mean to say is if I went to court over this, would I have a case and a right to out my garbage there regardless of whether I was able to fulfill some 'obligations' of rotation cleaning.? -- even if it not the polite thing to do.

Does he have any authority legally to prevent me from putting out garbage in my designated area?

My answer is "no". But I thought the question should be asked to law experts whom you can usually consult to free of charge through your city hall, rather than to be asked to anonymous internet users like me.

I agree with AK that you can suggest doing other jobs instead of doing things you cannot. By the way, because a lot of residents can't be there at a designated time in the morning, in my neighborhood, we set the rules so that whoever puts out the garbage first sets the net. Then, it is the job of the person in charge of the week to clean up and turn down the net as soon as that person can within the day. Sometimes we exchange turns if we are not available.

To me, it seems that a lot of your neighborhood problems can be solved by working around the rules. Hopefully, a public service would be able to help you.

I forgot to thank AK for the note. I do realize that there are neighborhoods that charge much more for entrance or even for the annual fee, but there are also many neighborhoods that don't even require an entrance fee. My point is that the OP has every right to know how the fee is used, more so if the fee is as high as that.

OP will start insisting he has a right to get the accounting report in English.

well in my area i am a member of this union ,I pay my annual dues 10,000 yen, I participate in every event and receive every information .
is necessary to join your neighborhood meeting, even if you don't understand Japanese.
even the city hall recognize it because they pass information to every village household through this union .
your job don't give you time isn't a good reason because all Japanese there is working.
your boss or coworkers also are members in there area.

you failed to make good communication to the neighbors, not made any effort to repair the relationship, and are finally trying to overcome (or win) to solve the problem. that thought will not work well.
you have to realize really that you can't survive alone (especially for a long time).
your mistakes will kick and destroy your body and mind, when you become weak.

To Ken,

in response you your callous and ignorant post, you don't even know what I have done or not done, you don't know the extent of 'bullying' and disrespect we have faced from this new chonaikai chief who is power tripping among others just because they are older they can disrespect younger people, and.. when all others before him were very reasonable people. We had no issues before him.
You assume I am at fault only when you have no details about my situation.

We are all free to choose who we want relationships with, and there are some people we have no wish to relate to. There are unreasonable people in this world, and we don't have to make friends with all of them. We can all act freely as we wish.

If you want examples of how unreasonable some of these community associations can be, read this: https://www.japantimes.co.jp/community/2014/07/21/issues/chores-charge...

Before you accuse me of all the wrong doing, maybe be more open minded since you have no real idea of the whole situation.

I came to this forum for the first time, to seek advice and help from people who might understand, if you don't understand and cannot help, but simply accuse, then don't post here.
I will not use this forum again as there will always be people who want to be on their high horse telling others they are wrong before even knowing the whole story.

By the sounds of it, you are Japanese and have no idea how it can be living here as a foreigner sometimes.
And what kind of strange comment about "it will destroy you when you are weak etc...."
Who are you, Yoda?

I suggest you get your facts straight before judging.

It's a difficult situation to comment on specifically when we aren't in your exact position, and hearing what you say is bullying language. I have to admit that at the moment it sounds like you aren't pulling your weight in the community by not paying the fees nor assisting with cleaning, or trying to communicate with your neighbours about a work-around. Yes, you've said your schedules don't allow you to help at 7.30am, but have you tried talking to the neighbours about doing the job at a different time, or contributing in another way? Given that you seem more keen to take a legal avenue than sort this out in person, it does come across that you want to keep not contributing, either financially or with your time, but still get the benefits of the other people doing the job. You need to show that you do want to contribute, rather than assuming you don't have to help out because the neighbours asked you to do so at a particular time that doesn't suit you.

On the flipside, perhaps your neighbours think you are being selfish because you have never contributed financially and don't want to help with cleaning. That could also be why the new leader is coming across as a bully - he has been told that you're unwilling to help out and thinks you need a firmer hand! Perhaps the previous leaders were no issue because they were nervous didn't want to argue, and what you took as acceptance was really anxiety over confronting you. The new person wants you to pull your weight, so appears bullying in comparison. Things can easily be lost in translation and this might be a far smaller issue that it seems at first hand because neither side really understands the other!

As I said, it's difficult to comment without hearing precisely what was said to you and knowing the exact history. But I would certainly suggest offering up some other options for you to contribute. Offer alternatives to show you're willing to be a good neighbour.