More days in Osaka or Kyoto?

I have about 12 days and 11 nights in Japan. Arriving to Osaka first >> then to Kyoto >> last stop will be Tokyo. On my last stop, I intend to spend 4 nights in tokyo before flying off. However i�fm torn between allocating more time in Osaka or Kyoto in the initial part of the trip - i�fve heard there are more stuff to do in Kyoto but not much night life (shops and food) like Osaka. What will you guys recommend? more time in Osaka or Kyoto? please help, thanks!

My recommendation after spending weeks on end in Osaka on business trips is 0 nights in Osaka and all the nights in Kyoto. Or if you are up to a hotel change a night somewhere between. Eg Hikone, Izu peninsula, Hakone�c.

Kyoto is a big city so yes there are many food options at night.

Hi! What I typically do is to base myself in Osaka and travel back and forth between both cities as they're merely 40 mins apart by limited express trains and 20 mins by Shinkansen. This way, you can spend time in Kyoto till late in the evening before catching a train back to Osaka.

However, you'll need to choose your accommodation somewhere near Osaka/Umeda, Shin-Osaka, or Juso (Hankyu Line) Stations to have easier access from Osaka to Kyoto, as well as to the rest of Osaka and other parts of the Keihanshin area.

Hope that helps :))

Well, in the past (maybe from 2015 to 2019), accommodations in Kyoto was hard to book on the touristic season, such as from 20th to 30th November and 25th Mar to 5th Apr. One month before, it was hard to find hotels in Kyoto, sometimes even in Osaka. Of course even if there was, it was very expensive. In that circumstances, "commuting" from other cities, even from Nagoya (35 min ride by Hikari express) was realistic. I remember I recommended Nagoya as a base city in Japanguide.

However, the hotel rooms increased in these 5 years subatantially. After and during COVID I traveled twice to Kyoto and now planning the next one in November, and my accommodations were and will be all new ones: two small hotels and two small serviced apartments. Everyone has more than 40 sqm rooms, washing facility and the fare is 10000-20000 yen per room per night even in the top season. Of course you can commute everyday, but note that if you want to maximize your time in Kyoto, you must do it in the morning and evening when many locals commute.

There are lots of restaurants in Kyoto, and I personally would rather stay in Kyoto. But if you seek after-9pm type activities, then Osaka is a better choice.

One night in Osaka is enough, unless you plan to do day trips from there. When you get up at 6 am or earlier to visit tourist spots in Kyoto before the crowd arrives, you don't need any attractions open past 10pm.

For shopping & food, I would allocate more time in Tokyo instead.

Thank you everyone for your recommendations! i have decided to spent one more night in Kyoto over Osaka :)
I do have more questions if you guys can help🙏🏻

1. Where is the ideal area to stay in tokyo? Am contemplating between Shinjuku and Ginza ( considering Location near Train station to get around, Food and shopping of course!)

2. Transport - Do i need the Whole Japan JR rail pass to travel via Shinkansen? Is it worth it? As mentioned, my trip will be Osaka >> Kyoto >> Tokyo .
I understand from Osaka to Kyoto and Kyoto to Tokyo, i will need to use JR Train as it is faster.
However, for within and inside the city itself, I�fm not sure if it is necessary to travel using the shinkansen or will subway trains be good enough?

thanks in advance!

1) There's no good/bad choice really, it depends on which places you want to visit and your budget. I like the area around Higashi-Ginza for shopping/food, but there might be more variety and nightlife around Shinjuku.
Note that there are both "trains" and "metros" in Tokyo. Some metro stations are often quite deep, ie, there can be lot of stairs to go down to the platforms, whereas the train lines are on the surface.

2) Forget about the national JR pass. The official booking app/website for the Tokaido Shinkansen (that runs between Osaka, Kyoto and Tokyo) is: https://smart-ex.jp/en/index.php
While it's possible to buy tickets on the spot at a train station, you can get discounted fares by buying them in advance.

For transportation within cities, everything you need is here: https://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2359_003.html

Buy an ICOCA card in Osaka. Or if your phone supports it, there are digital versions as well. It's like the EZ-Link in Singapore: works almost anywhere in the country and you can also pay in some stores with it.

You heard correctly - Osaka has a much better night life, though Kyoto has more then enough as far as eating goes. Evenings are when Osaka is at its best (Dotonbori, Abeno Harukas, Shinsekai, Umeda Sky Bldg, Cosmo Tower, TeamLab at the Nagai Botantical, etc) and it can take well more than just one night to explore them all if that's your wish.
You could stay at either Shinjuku or Ginza for Tokyo - though Shinjuku or Shibuya tends to be more expensive than the eastern side of the city, like Ueno or Taito-ku. Unless you are planning to stay out way past midnight after the trains and buses have stopped, as long as you're near a train or subway station, you'll be fine. Shinjuku has a very vibrant nightlife, and it is also an excellent location to be for day trips west of the city. Ginza is known for its high end shopping, but you don't have to stay there to do that.
If you're only going one way from Kansai to Tokyo, then a JR Rail Pass is a big mistake, even if you bought it at the pre-October prices. Just get regular fare tickets, and take a Nozomi train - saving you nearly half an hour in time to boot. You don't need to take the bullet train for local travel. Local JR lines or the subway will serve you just fine. A 48 or 72-hour subway pass could save you some money if going all over. That's up to your plans. Or just use an IC card - no real savings, but very convenient. If you get an Icoca card in Kansai though, you would not be able to refund any balance in Tokyo.